masseffectfandomcom-20200222-history
Talk:M-920 Cain
Refiling the ammo It works on PC as well, I believe No. of heavy weapons upgrades How many HW ammo upgrades did you have before you unlocked the Cain? I only required 3, not 4 as the original fact state. I don't know if it makes any difference, but I was playing on hardcore (PC version). Dch2404 20:40, February 22, 2010 (UTC) :Agreed. ShadowRanger 18:55, March 5, 2010 (UTC) Physics of the weapon Not to rain on anyone's parade, but the effect of this weapon doesn't seem to match the design as described. My physics is weak, so please correct me if I made a mistake, but a 25 g slug at 5 km/s has a momentum of 125 kg * m / s. Neglecting air resistance, that's roughly equivalent to dropping an 1 kg lead "spear" from a height of 91 meters, or roughly the 30th floor of an office building. Deadly to a pedestrian beneath it to be sure, but hardly enough to trigger an explosion or a mushroom cloud. And beyond that, in using the weapon against the final boss, I've noticed I need to time the shot well, because even after the weapon fires there appears to be a transit delay to the target, during which time it can and does dodge. Hardly a speed of 5 km/s. I realize I'm being really pedantic, but the description and the effect appear to have nothing in common. Are my physics off, or did the designers (who wrote the description) and the actual implementers not communicate at all? ShadowRanger 18:55, March 5, 2010 (UTC) :Hmm... Now that I think about it, kinetic energy, not momentum, is probably the value that matters. I never did understand when one or the other applies, but the kinetic energy of the Cain round would be about 312,500 joules, vs. a "mere" 7,812.5 for my 1 kg spear. Still not sure how damaging 312,500 joules is, and clearly the disparity in the description speed vs. in-game speed remains an issue, but at least the description might be accurate considered on its own. ShadowRanger 19:02, March 5, 2010 (UTC) :: interesting discussion, my physics is rusty having not done physics since 1st year of university. Considering Little Boy was at least 50 terajoules and flattened the city infrastructure in a 2 km diameter, that might mean there were 15.9 terajoules of energy per square kilometre, so that's 1.59 gigajoules of energy per 10 metres squared (an average room size?). Since the Cain has a mushroom cloud, we'll consider it a nuke as well. 312,500 joules of energy seems to wipe out a room of about 10 metres square. So the Cain has 0.002% the power of Little Boy. Note that this is all complete rubbish. :: On a more serious note, yes Bioware really did screw up the physics. Take the M82 anti-materiel rifle, which has a muzzle velocity of 850 m/s (about 1/6 of the Cain), and it fires 0.50 BMG which weigh 40 to 50 grams. Even if the 0.50 BMG was not armour-piercing, I highly doubt it'll cause anything more than a spark upon impact. And let's face it, you don't see bullets mid-flight and the Cain projectile is definitely visible. Then again, there is the mystery of the high-explosive matrix. Dch2404 19:39, March 5, 2010 (UTC) the i calculated the ke of the projectile ant it is equal to about 3000 sticks of dynamite kinetic energy :*.5*.025*(5000^2) =312500 :*finding what fraction of power of the fat man it has :*G88000000000000/312500 =281600000 :*281600000^-1 =3.55113636 × 10^-9 :*G(3.55113636×10^-9)*21000 =7.45738636 × 10^-5 :*multiplying it by the fat mans power in dynamite :*G42000000*(7.45738636 × 10^-5) =3132.10227 :* remember that kinetic energy and not momentum is what matters [[User:Baalazmon|''Baalazmon'']] 18:22, April 22, 2010 (UTC) The actual shot from the Cain looks like sort of a grenade that travels in a parabolic trajectory at a definitely subsonic velocity. So yea, the description has very little to do with how the weapon actually works in-game 22:56, May 31, 2010 (UTC) Can Anyone Confirm Cain Glitch? "There is an infinity ammo glitch with Cain. Just reload it right after shot and ammo will back to its previous amount. " I read this under Player Notes and after trying the glitch a few times, it doesn't seem to be working. I've read about this glitch on other sites for the PC, but I'm using the xbox 360, even though I doubt that this is the problem, it may just be the way I'm doing the glitch. Both sites said that after the initial shot to keep holding down the fire button while pressing the reload button after each shot. But after each shot (unless I have 200%) the base value doesn't change.I just want to know if anyone else can do this glitch or post a video otherwise I think that it should be taken down to avoid confusion. 01:03, March 23, 2010 (UTC) I tried also to confirm the glitch on PC. I have updated the game to 1.01. I had no luck. Shepard said to me once that "No thermal clips" though. Dogmatix314 19:56, April 14, 2010 (UTC) Cain and Adrenaline Rush Does anyone know whether the Adrenaline Rush damage bonus can apply to Cain? And if so, at which point does it count (i.e. beginning of the charge-up, the moment of the shot, the moment of the explosion)? -tmk 22:59, May 31, 2010 (UTC) Why wont it fire? Idk if this is a glitch or what but I just baught it and brought it along Tali's recrutment mission to use against the collosis. I took aim and all that happened is steam came out the barrel? Did I not have enough ammo or what? :You need 100% ammo for the Cain to fire, any less and that's what you get, steam. So you probably didn't have enough ammo. Lancer1289 22:06, June 18, 2010 (UTC) :Ok thanks. I think it had 80 or so. It seems like a waste of resourses though becauseof the ammo requirement. You start the level with only 50 I think, so the game doesnt let you shoot it until the end of the level. ::Yea the Cain is a one time use weapon, which is why I almost never use the thing. If you are going to use it, then make sure you have enough ammo and plan exactly when and where you are going to use it in a mission. Lancer1289 23:04, June 18, 2010 (UTC) :: Though through a simple modification to game files any weapon can use no ammo and have any rate of fire. Having a Cain that shoots 6 rockets a second is quite cheap though. 21:09, July 10, 2010 (UTC) :: Cain Projectile Weight Is 25 grams correct? That's less than a pound. Mictlantecuhtli 01:35, August 21, 2010 (UTC) :I don't see why it wouldn't be. The weapon uses the same basic principle as a railgun or magnetic accelerator (accelerating a small projectile to great speeds, resulting in tremendous destructive power). Even today there are prototypes that can launch a 7 lb projectile to such speeds that it has the destructive power of a Tomahawk cruise missile. SpartHawg948 01:45, August 21, 2010 (UTC) ::Yeah I know, I am the one who added the real world comparison after Lancer removed my mention of the davy crockett. Mictlantecuhtli 01:47, August 21, 2010 (UTC) :::So... why the question then? SpartHawg948 01:50, August 21, 2010 (UTC) ::::(Edit conflict)Yea the railgun trivia has a basis, as I just explained to someone on my talk page. However since the nuke cannon was an actual nuclear rifle, while this one isn't, and the Cain has more incommon with a railgun anyway, I believed that was valid trivia. Also the 25 grmas is accurate, jsut checked. Also jsut to note that this is also how the weapons work as well. Shearing off small bits of metal and accelerating them to great speeds. I think we have it somewhere that the individaul slugs are the size of grains of sand or something small. So 25 grams for this wouldn't be that far off. Lancer1289 01:52, August 21, 2010 (UTC) :::::Actually, just to point out, the Davy Crockett wasn't a 'nuclear rifle', or a 'recoilless nuclear rifle'. It was a 'nuclear recoilless gun'. This may seem a semantic trick, but it isn't. Recoilless gun, and the related recoilless rifle, is a term for a very specific type of weapon, which the Dacy Crockett was, just with a different type of ammo. Inserting anything between recoilless and rifle or gun negates that terminology, as does 'nuclear rifle', as a rifle is a personal firearm, while a recoilless gun/rifle is essentially a piece of light artillery. SpartHawg948 01:55, August 21, 2010 (UTC) ::::::Oops messed up on the terminology. Lancer1289 01:58, August 21, 2010 (UTC) :::::::I was just curious where the heavy hitter railguns are in the future, though the weight may be to allow the person firing to use it without killing themselves in the process. Wasn't that derelict reaper hit with some type of railgun? If so might be worth making a note about in that article. Mictlantecuhtli 01:59, August 21, 2010 (UTC) ::::::::No, it was hit by a mass accelerator round. Rail guns seem to have been superseded by mass accelerators, which are of course mounted as weapons on warships, and used as personal weapons in scaled-down form. SpartHawg948 02:02, August 21, 2010 (UTC) :::::::::What's the difference? They both work on the same principles don't they? Mictlantecuhtli 02:08, August 21, 2010 (UTC)